I don't fully understand this "I won't buy a fairphone, because it doesn't have a audio jack" way of thinking.
Are there any phones that actually has a jack and still gets updates?

I agree it would be a nice feature, but the few I have spoken to, whom actually complain about this, has ended up buying another phone that IMO is worse and also has no jack.

I'm just confused, not trying to be negative or mean towards anyone.

I'm writing this comment on a Oneplus 6, which has a headphone jack. Since I'm using PostmarketOS on this sucker, I also get all up-to-date packages and kernel. ️

What you daily drive postmarket OS?

How is it for daily use?

I would add proper Linux mainline support here.

That would allow other non-android options as well, and makes it be supported for the near future. And will likely have a network effect, allowing other phones with similar hardware to be supported as well.

Mainline Linux support is a chipset feature, the manufacturer has little control over it. And even then, you have manufacturers like Mediatek that theoretically have full mainline support, but the bootloader is totally locked and no custom ROMs exist.

Most mainlining effort is financed by the people that build products with it, not the chipset vendors. Chipset vendors are only interested in providing a working demo application, not much more. If someone promises 8 years maintenance, they could also in parallel work on mainline support, so that it can continue to be supported.

About locked bootloaders, sure you need to be able to unlock them as well, but that often also is a decision of the product manufacturers, not the chipset vendors.

If people, not only lemmy's people and a small minority care about the jack people would buy phones with jacks, there are good options but very few people do.

Most people actually like and prefere bluethooth.

Same for ROMs, when was the last time you said "wow, I sure miss custom roms" and the whole room went "meeetooo". Hell, most people don't even know what a custom rom is.

This is not what "the people want" is "what lemmy thinks everyone ones, but is actually only them circle jerking".

Downvote me to hell, but is the truth.

If a manufacturer wants to lock the bootloader, they can, true. But sometimes, you have phones in the same family where the Qualcomm chipset supports unlocking and the Mediatek one doesn't. E.g. Xiaomi before they restricted unlocking further.

Well i know a lot of people irl who miss the headphone jack and none are lemmy users and not all are nerds

I know a lot of people who don't, so? Anecdotal information.

Don't mistake correleation and causation. I don't know the specifics, but bootloaders are software and socs are hardware. The bootloaders keys are fused into the hardware, so that only that bootloaders can boot. When you buy a soc, no keys are fused in, this happens at the manufacturer factory deployment process. The bootloaders can then decide if the device supports an 'unlocked' state, and displays the warnings if unlocked. The bootloaders are build and configured by the manufacturer. However, the soc vendors will give the product vendors a SDK containing tested sources and configuration for their soc.

Here is what could explain your observation, manufacturer is lazy and doesn't care to change the default configuration of the bootloader. And the default configuration of Mediatek and Qualcomm SDKs are different.

There is a semi-recent thread about Mediatek at https://www.reddit.com/r/PocoPhones/comments/1cuwkm0/lies_about_mediatek/ where it started that their source code is incomplete, they don't provide it at all. Hence no manufacturer can mainline it. And this is one of the reasons custom ROM development for them is so slow compared to Qualcomm SOCs.

We don't have independant studies in this debate afaik sor anecdotal info is relevant here

Depends what you need on a daily basis. GPS does not work, even if it did, I have never gotten routing to work correctly in Pure maps. The photos are cropped-in, have a green tinge, and a faint blocky pattern mixed in, on the one back camera that works. You need to open an overlay that gives you a slider to control focus and exposure, since IIRC that stuff is not in the gnome camera app. The front camera is completely pink. No suspend, since the phone will not unsuspend for sms and phone calls. Firefox on a mobile screen is also pretty sketchy, especially when you start using add-ons.

However, for all those woes, there are some pretty cool advantages (phosh DE on oneplus 6):

• Images in the clipboard
• App overview keeps apps in the same order
• Calendar and ticket box plugins to use in the lock screen.
• Logging into Nextcloud in the settings is all you need for contacts, files, and calendar sync. No dav5x needed like on Android.
• No notification spam from system apps like is default on Android.
• No need to learn new apps, they are the same ones I use on my desktop.
• apk, the alpine package manager, is wicked fast imo
• Most of the apos I use are gtk4, so it's pretty visually consistent.

Alright. I know no one outside of lemmy who cares about the jack, you do. Where does that leave us?

Well, some people care about it then

I will never buy another phone without wireless charging. Yes, I know it has significant downsides. I do not care, I am hard on my ports, wireless charging doesn't break. Given that qi2 is now available as a standard and blunts the severity of the downsides as well ... Realistically not buying another phone until I can get an unlocked bootloader qi2 phone with decent specs.

Yes, as your link states, it is the product manufacturers responsibility to release the code. And if they don't have it, they can sue Mediatek.

But very likely have access to the source, otherwise they couldn't adapt the kernel & co. to their boards. Soc is just one part of the whole board, full of other components that need kernel configurations...

But anyway, this thread it about the kernel, we talked about the bootloader and why it cannot be unlocked, which is a separate issue.

Manufacturer needs access to the bootloader to put their Android key for the image, which contains their special apps, in place. So they have sources. To be able to flash a different bootloader, they need to be able to fuse the bootloader key into the SOC, so they have a unlocked soc. So they have everything to offer unlockable bootloaders, if they care for it.

Yeah sorry, I kind of went on a tangent.

Regarding the source, I was under the impression that manufacturers get some kind of devkit for the SoC that works against a given kernel version (one of the LTS ones Android usually uses) and binary drivers for the non-open parts. One could sue the manufacturer after buying a phone and demand release of the source, but this won't hit meditated because the vendors won't go after them or their license gets terminated. Legally difficult but similar to the grsecurity situation: yeah you have rights, but if you exercise them, we choose not to do business with you anymore.

Shameful situation and I think Google wanted to get out of this legal area when they developed Fuchsia as this concept would solve technical and legal issues for manufacturers.

I'm not sure where this discussion stemmed from because from my knowledge, the Fairphone does allow custom ROMs, though you lose some boot security functionality? I didn't read too much into it yet